Ирвинг против Липштадт
Holocaust Denial on Trial, Trial Transcripts, Day 24: Electronic Edition
Pages 191 - 192 of 192
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1 "To be asked what you think this would have
2conveyed to Hitler, which is I think what Mr Rampton was
4 Answer: "Firstly, I accept the document was in
5all probability shown to Hitler. Secondly, I think in all
6probability he paid no attention to it, the reason being
7the date, the height of the Stalingrad crisis".
8 If there is going to be a retreat from that
9position, it is going to have to have, in submission,
10quite a good reason.
11 MR IRVING: Well, my response is that I think documents are
12often shown to learned counsel which learned counsel
13sometimes pay no attention to. I think Mr Carmen is an
14example of that.
15 MR RAMPTON: I am not Mr Carmen for one thing, and I shall not
16say what I feel about that.
17 MR IRVING: Also your Lordship will remember ----
18 MR JUSTICE GRAY: Let Mr Rampton tell us more about it.
19 MR RAMPTON: For another thing, that is only to say that it
20seems that that concession, and I advisedly use that word,
21seems to remain in place.
22 MR JUSTICE GRAY: Indeed it is fortified, because Mr Irving is
23there saying that, all right, it may have been shown to
24Hitler, but he paid no attention to it, well, that is
25almost the same as saying it was not shown to him. But he
26goes done in day 4 and 5 in the passages that you have
1referred to I think to accept that Hitler knew and
3 MR RAMPTON: Yes, knew about the systematic mass shootings in
5 MR IRVING: Your Lordship remember that I produced evidence to
6you a day or two later showing that on precisely that day
7or the day before one document of exactly the same nature
8was shown to Hitler on two successive days, submitted to
9him and obviously not read by him.
10 MR JUSTICE GRAY: Yes. I suspect the position will emerge that
11you have slightly shifted your ground backwards and
12forwards in the course of your answers to Mr Rampton.
13 MR IRVING: It is highly possible that one learns as one goes
14along, and one would be incorrigible if one did not.
15 MR JUSTICE GRAY: I will not comment about that, but you have
16now put your case actually in considerable detail to
17Dr Longerich and we have now had his answers.
18 MR IRVING: Yes.
19 MR JUSTICE GRAY: So tell me what your final stance is, because
20I would like to know, but the evidence is all in now.
21 MR RAMPTON: I would like to know too.
22 MR JUSTICE GRAY: So 10.30 tomorrow morning.
23 < (The witness withdrew)
24(The court adjourned until the following day)
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