Irving v. Lipstadt

Transcripts

Holocaust Denial on Trial, Trial Transcripts, Day 27: Electronic Edition

Pages 71 - 75 of 183

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 1 MR RAMPTON:     Rabble rousing.
 2 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Otherwise no. I think that must be the
 3distinction.
 4 MR RAMPTON:     You will see the rabble. When you get to Halle,
 5you will see the skinhead rabble and then you will see
 6Mr Irving standing on a scaffold rousing the rabble.
 7 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Right.
 8 MR RAMPTON:     This is a film made by Mr Irving himself,
 9I think. It comes from his own video, my Lord, called
10"Ich komme wieder". It has probably been edited out of
11existence.
12 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Where is this?
13 MR RAMPTON:     Passau. This is No. 3, Passau DVU. It is very
14short.
15 (The video continued)
16 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     This is Gerhard Frey, this person.
17 Q. [Mr Rampton]     That is Gerhard Frey.
18 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Yes, this person in the middle here. Left to the -- no,
19right from here, right to David Irving, there you see
20David Irving and on the right you see next to the middle
21Gerhard Frey, the DVU chief, the chief of the German
22Volksunion, of the Deutsche Volksunion, the leader.
23 (The video continued)
24 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     That is it.
25 MR RAMPTON:     That is it.
26 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Was that Passau in '87 or?

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 1 MR RAMPTON:     Yes?
 2 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     No, not in '87.
 3 MR RAMPTON:     '91?
 4 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     In '91.
 5 MR RAMPTON:     The next one, my Lord, is the long one, the
 6Leuchter Congress. I would like the people in charge of
 7the machine to zip through -- I do not want a whole lot of
 8speeches.
 9 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Yes, I agree.
10 Q. [Mr Rampton]     A whole lot of speeches from this group, just to know who
11they are and get a flavour of the occasion.
12 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     This is Ewald Althans. It is before the museum in Munich.
13 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     What is the date of this?
14 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     23rd March '91.
15 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Thank you.
16 MR RAMPTON:     Can you pause there a moment? I would like to
17tell his Lordship or I will ask a question, who made this
18tape?
19 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     It is shown in the beginning, it is Samisdart(?). This is
20the name of the Samisdart publisher, Ernst Zundel, in
21Canada.
22 Q. [Mr Rampton]     Zundel?
23 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Zundel.
24 Q. [Mr Rampton]     Commercially made, was it?
25 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     It was -- it was remade for publishing.
26 Q. [Mr Rampton]     Yes.

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 1 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     So it was cut and there are written things on it, so if
 2you are interested we can go into details, but...
 3 Q. [Mr Rampton]     Excuse me, this is a film made by Mr Zundel for his own
 4purposes, professionally made, so it has been cut and
 5edited?
 6 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Exactly.
 7 Q. [Mr Rampton]     And was it to be sold and distributed to the world at
 8large or whoever wanted it?
 9 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     I am not sure if it is only for limited purposes, of
10limited audiences and publics, I do not know.
11 Q. [Mr Rampton]     But the important thing about this is it is Zundel's
12document?
13 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Exactly.
14 Q. [Mr Rampton]     It was disclosed by Mr Irving and so far -- you have seen
15it before.
16 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Yes.
17 Q. [Mr Rampton]     The Defendants have not tampered with it?
18 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     The Defendants?
19 Q. [Mr Rampton]     Tampered, fiddled?
20 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     No, no, it is just by Zundel.
21 Q. [Mr Rampton]     It is an entire Zundel document?
22 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Right.
23 Q. [Mr Rampton]     Thank you very much.
24 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     This is Mrs Von Tonningen. This is a person from the
25Netherlands, a networker of high skills, very identified
26with the National Socialist cause. This is the famous

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 1Ahmed Rami with his very anti-Semitic speech. This is the
 2translator. It is Bouffeur from France who is also active
 3in the revisionist scene.
 4     This is another translator, Fritz Becker from
 5Einshaus. Henry Rock, he is a stated, he is an author, a
 6Gerstein expert and editor of the French Zeitschift Review
 7D'histoire Revisionist.
 8 MR IRVING:     My Lord, can I draw your attention to say that so
 9far we have not seen my face once on the screen yet.
10 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     I was looking out for you.
11 MR IRVING:     Yes. You will recognise me when I come.
12 (The video continued)
13 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Can I ----
14 THE INTERPRETER:     Since we are playing the sound, would you
15like a running translation of it?
16 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     No, I think we are not going to do it that
17way.
18 MR RAMPTON:     No. We will get it transcribed and translated in
19each case.
20 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     I think that is the right way.
21 MR RAMPTON:     We might have had enough of this.
22 MR IRVING:     I was enjoying that!
23 MR RAMPTON:     Could we fast forward, please, since we do not
24know what he is saying?
25 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     I do not think, from what I could gather,
26there was very much that was of any particular materiality

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 1it is a chronicle of the ----
 2 MR RAMPTON:     On this occasion it may be more a question of who
 3else was there.
 4 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Yes, that is the point, is it not?
 5 MR RAMPTON:     And what they were saying.
 6 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Who is he?
 7 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     Is this Staglich again?
 8 MR RAMPTON:     It is the same old faces.
 9 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     This is one person there ----
10 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Can you go back a bit?
11 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     --- who will speak later, Peter Verala to the right, just
12to the right. This is Pedro Verala. He stood all the
13time in the back of the stage. This is Paul Knutsen a
14Danish activist of the same scene, both revisionists and
15right wing extremist activities involved. This is now
16Pedro Verala speaking and having a tape of the Haute Lyons
17D'Egrelle(?). That was the Lyons D'Egrelle.
18 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Was that Althans?
19 MR RAMPTON:     Althans in the ----
20 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     This is Althans again, right.
21 MR JUSTICE GRAY:     Yes, I thought so.
22 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     This is now Ditlieb Felderer, a Swedish activist of the
23international.
24 MR RAMPTON:     Is it a man or a woman -- oh, it is a man.
25 A. [Dr Hajo Funke]     There is Christian Worch, organizer of the security aspect
26of this conference, with his troopers, if I may say so.

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